Protagonist Syndrome

[kempff]

I can guarantee you, without the Sephiroth surprise, Kingdom Hearts would not be nearly as successful as it is.

How many of us spent time to beat him? Or even tried to perfect their approach?

[Akito]

Haha, you make Sora sound like some sort of brain-washed child assassin, Hero. I think we've reached a general consensus.

Alright, which KH protagonist shall we tear up next? How about the classic, almost cliche, personification of 'talented person turning to the dark side and forced to fight his best friend,'?

EDIT: Heh, I wouldn't go so far as to attribute a large portion of KH's success to Sephiroth. It was the entire assimilation of Final Fantasy that did that.

It was nice Seph's role in KH2 was expanded from KH1 though, instead of having him pop up randomly in an arena match.

[kempff]

I remember for a month straight, if not longer, people (news, magazines, Internets) talking about the surprise Sephiroth fight.
I will not rank it on top of the Aerith death in the young days of the PS one, but he was a brilliant add on.
Do you not remember the mutter at the time about how unsure people were the game would even come out?
It was the widespread opinion that KH would fail horribly since the two mega corporations would have to work together.

All characters from KH's are Mary and Gary Sue's.

[Akito]

All Final Fantasy characters, at least. Donald and Goofy made convincing sidekick material. It was an odd concept really at the time, here was a Final Fantasy-esque hero fighting alongside Disney characters. People couldn't be blamed for being skeptical.

[Detox]

Aug 5, 2009 17:56:29 GMT -5 Akito said:

How about the classic, almost cliche, personification of 'talented person turning to the dark side and forced to fight his best friend,'?

Riku?

Riku was meant to be the original Keyblade Wielder, but he turned to Darkness, so Kingdom Key chose Sora instead.

I can only imagine what KH would have been with Riku as the main, angsty hero, with Sora attaining a Keyblade later all in the name of following Riku's footsteps.

[Night Sky]

I can only imagine what the game would have been like if they had stayed with Mickey as the main protagonist. For cliche heroes, Sora and the others at least made a lasting impression on me to put them in an entirely different class of JRPG heroes.

[IX. Demyx]

The game probably wouldn't have been taken as seriously with Mickey as the protagonist. I mean, would serious gamers have gone to a game that had Mickey fighting alongside Donald and Goofy with a key? I think not.

Beyond that, if Mickey had been the main character, he wouldn't have become the Chuck Norris of Kingdom Hearts like he is.

And yes, he is the Chuck Norris of Kingdom Hearts. My examples:
1. He's only playable when the main character dies.
2. He can run around in a Org. XIII cloak, and have no one recognize him until he removes his hood, despite his unique build.
3. He's a king alongside being a badass.

If he was a protagonist, none of these would have occured!

[kempff]

How popular is Disney though?

Of the two mega corporations, which do you all think is more popular and well known?
I hope you choose Disney.

Mickey would have been a fine main character, but then it'd have been a very different game....so you can't have it both ways.
That said, the game would have sold very well for just having Mickey as the main character.

[Detox]

I personally prefer it with SE-esque characters than a Disney-esque character.

Automatically, I think the maturity level would go down with Mickey as the main character.

[IX. Demyx]

Maybe...

But maybe not. Mickey gets some pretty good moments, despite being a rather silly looking character.

[kempff]

Aug 5, 2009 19:35:16 GMT -5 Detox said:

Automatically, I think the maturity level would go down with Mickey as the main character.

Oh quite definitely.
Disney is policed on an extreme level to be child age ranged.
It was a concern at KH's inception to make the game age appropriate.
I mean, watch their channel, it's horrendous how PC and clean it is.

Look at what Disney did to classic folk tales; they've ingrained in our minds they're for children. That's how they made money, start with kids and you keep them forever. Of course the absolutely mind blowing drawing and movie productions for the time factor in. They're still incredibly done movies.

Don't underestimate Disney's role in this.
I'd really like a making of movie to come out for this series.
Interviews with all levels from Squenix of Japan, of American, etc.
The same for Disney in America, Japan, etc.
How did they decide what was ok? Etc.

I really hope this could or has happen/ed.
Considering how strong Disney is in this, and business negotiations with the Japanese being a fine art, it would be very interesting.

[IX. Demyx]

That would be cool to see.
They'd take out some worlds though, or do like the manga did and put both plots of each world into one visit.

It would most likely turn out awesome though. Or, turn out like most video game movies, and fail miserably. Either or.

[kempff]

I was talking about a "making of Kingdom Hearts" the series. A documentary, not a theatrical movie.

Kingdom Hearts does not have the fan-base to warrant a movie.
Unlike folk tales, I don't video games have much staying power, so when it come out only adults would go that felt like it, no children, the most profitable market for KH.
Remember how reluctant Squenix was to make Advent Children?
They were right to make it, and right to not let it go into theaters.
(FFVII is a rare exception to most games, it was truly an epic due to many reasons; hype, drama, graphics, the new age and feel of FF, etc.)
The Spirits Within almost ruined the deal of the Enix-Square merger btw.

[IX. Demyx]

Oh.
That makes more sense. And yes, I didn't want to talk about Spirits Within. That movie can be counted as torture.

[Detox]

Aug 5, 2009 19:57:47 GMT -5 @kempff said:

The Spirits Within almost ruined the deal of the Enix-Square merger btw.

I didn't hear anything about that. o.o